Ep. 96: Bigfoot Crossroads with Matt Knapp

And I just turned around and I call ass out of there. I was done. I wasn't dealing with them. The hypocrisy of the cult is one of the things that turned me away the quickest. When I turned my head lights on, it turned and looked at us. And one of the things I remember the most where the eyes were going red. I see an orb of light. It is just circling these steps like it is waiting for me. And he begins to tell them that he saw UFO. They're basically like, what are you talking about. That's seven foot up on a tree, peeking around it, and that's where I saw the top of the muzzle, nose and the eyes. As soon as I made eye contact with this thing, it don't like death. Welcome back to Tenfoil Tells. I'm your host, Brandon ran Night's episode. We're gonna be joined by my guest, Matthew Knapp. Matthew is the host of Bigfoot Crossroads. You're not familiar with that. I definitely recommend checking it out. You're a fan of Tenfoil Teals, you'll probably be a fan of Bigfoot Crossroads too. We do similar things. Matthew used to be a Bigfoot researcher and then he got into the whole podcasting thing. We've been talking back and forth for a while, so we thought it'd be a good idea to do a little bit of cross promoting. He's gonna be on an episode of Tenfoil Teals and I'm gonna be on an episode of Bigfoot Crossroads. Make sure to go check that out. You can find links to show in the show notes. But before we bring Matthew on, you've ever had an experience and you would like to be on an episode of ten Foil Tells, you can send an email to Tenfoil Tales Podcast at gmail dot com or go to the website Tenfoil Hotels dot com. You can go the contact section either way. It works for me. It's just make sure you get a message to me and we will get you scheduled for our future episode. If you'd like to help the podcast out, please continue to share it around. Sharing the podcast is one of the best ways of getting the word out there. It finds new listeners, it helps find new guests, and just overall brings new awareness to the podcast. So for everyone that's been out there sharing it, I truly appreciate you guys, there wouldn't be a podcast without all the listeners, So everyone that's taking the time to share the podcast around just know that I do truly appreciate you. You can also help out by leaving a five star rating and review wherever you listen to Tenfoiltels. If you're on Apple and you write a review out, I'll make sure to read it on an upcoming episode to give you guys a shout out for it. You can also help the podcast out by joining the Patreon, but you get access to all the episodes right after they record it. They're all ad free. There's also some bonus content on there, like Crinkled Conspiracy, the Patreon exclusive show that I'm doing with my friend Ed that is only available on the Patreon. There's also a free tier, so if you don't want to pay the whole dollar ninety nine a month, you can still get access to crinkle Conspiracy in some of the other episodes in the free tier. Make sure to follow me around on social media Facebook and Instagrams, where I'm most active. Look for Brandon tenfoil Tels on Facebook. You can talk to me that way too. There are a few events coming up this fall that I'll be appearing at I'll have a vendor booth set up, and I'll be speaking at a couple events too. The first one is September fourteenth, Bigfoots and Bruise and Spirits too, and to Wajack, Michigan at the Sister Lake Brewing Company. I'll have a booth set up there on my recording rig. I'll also be at the Indiana Bigfoot Conference September twenty seventh and twenty eighth. That's in Nashville, Indiana. I will also be at Para Unity six in Miami County, Indiana at the four H Fairgrounds on October nineteenth, and then finally on October twenty sixth, I'll be in Crawfordville, Indiana for the Crawfordsville Pair Noormal Convention. Again. At all those, I'll have a booth set up. I'll have some merch stuff on my recording rig. At the pair Unity event and the Crawfordsville event, I'll be doing guests speaking. So you'd like to hear me talk about some things in person, that'll be your chance to do that. Those two events are free. The other two do require tickets. You can find more information about those tickets by going to the show notes. But I think now it's time to bring Matthew on. I've been looking forward to talk with him. We chat back and forth quite a bit on Facebook Messenger, but now it's time to actually sit down and talk in person. So I hope you guys enjoy the conversation. So sit back, relax, and enjoy the show. I'd like to take time to welcome my guest today, Matthew Nap from Bigfoot Crossroads. Thanks for coming here and talking to me. Yeah. Man, it's nice to put a voice to it. We've been chatting a little bit recently, and this is the first time we've actually talked. Yeah, that's a My life is behind either a text message or something for most time, Like people don't ever really know my voice listens to the podcast or something like that, because I'm not an outgoing person in real life when I get a phone call. When I get a phone call, I'm like, oh, why are you calling you? Why you just text me? Oh jeez, you're one of those Yeah, one of those people. I like to maintain the Wizard of Ozma steak of myself and just try to avoid video at all costs. But I'm a talker. I'm a talker for sure. I can talk when I need to. I have to deal with a lot of talking for work purposes, so this is my outlet to not have to be in the normal routine. And then it's weird because I used to be the frontman of a band, so I always had to talk to people anyways on stage. So I always say I'm not an outgoing person. I don't like talking to people. You gotta do a podcast where I talk to people, and I used to give a front man of a man. So it's like, maybe I actually do enjoy and I just think I don't. I don't know, or you're just self loathing and just do things you hate to do. That's actually probably pretty spot on. So there's that. But yeah, so I know from talking whether you used to be a bigfoot researcher, you don't really do a whole lot of that anymore, do you. No. No, I hung up those boots years ago. I had quite a number of experiences, did it for probably a little over a decade, and it just kind of got to the point for a long time I was able to just take off and go out to the woods, you know, and spend time doing it. But then my life kind of changed and I couldn't spend as much time out there like I wanted to. And at that point I kind of decided, you know, I really accomplished everything I can accomplish. At this point, I felt that to advance in any facet of research, it would require a lot of time and money spent doing it, and I just didn't have the resources. And like I said, the life changes, I couldn't take off like I was. So I decided to start focusing on the grind of the books and you know, the former research that came before me and everything, and ended up becoming a podcaster somewhere in the process. That is seems to be a trend. I've noticed with people, even myself, they I don't know, if it's our last resort to do something. We do other things, and then they're like, all right, well now I'm just going to do a podcast, but yeah, I don't know. I got involved in bigfoot podcasting pretty early, whenever it wasn't really a thing, before people were even calling them podcasts, and I really enjoyed it was I kind of grew up around recording and stuff. I had a stepfather for a while that was a musician and learned about the studio and got into mixing and stuff, so that side interested me. And then I like to hear the stories and talk to people about Bigfoot, of course, and eventually just kind of ended up moving from the producer side of things to the host side of things. And yeah, did a podcast for a while called Bigfoot Out Wall Radio with a couple of well known gentlemen from the South in the Bigfoot world, and I kind of had them in the spotlight doing the majority of the talking, and I stayed behind the scenes most of the time, and then decided to branch out and do my own sure with Bigfoot Crossroads. You've been doing it for how long now? Oh? Jeez man, So this version of Bigfoot Crossroads is probably a couple of years old. Whenever I started doing podcasting on a regular basis, it was probably around two thousand and fourish, and then got real serious around two thousand and eight, I would say, and have been doing it consistently ever since. Back then, they weren't podcasts like you mentioned. I think they were blogs. Blogs. Yeah, yeah, there's a site called blog Talk Radio, and we had all just call in on our phones and the whole thing was just done over the phone. Yeah, it sucked, It was horrible. I didn't live in the times of being able to listen to stuff like that, because back in those days I had dial up internet, so it would have tooken like five days for one thing to download just to listen to it. So those were the dark ages for me. It wasn't until like two thousand and seven. In two thousand and eight, I think, is when I finally lived in an area where I could get cable internet. So I thought I was living in the future with how fast I things worked and I could listen and watch things, And that was like the infancy of YouTube, right back in the wild West days of YouTube, before they banned your videos over saying specific words or something. Yeah, I remember that. I remember that one of the two guys were running it. Then I think Google bottom ount and everything's changed since then. Yeah, it's a different monster, the monopoly of the big corporations. But anyways, not trying to get myself banned again. Yeah, careful, they're always listening. But no, So what led you into wanting to look into bigfoot curiosity? Honestly, I was always interested in just all the weird stuff, the unexplained stuff. My interests dimmed from being actively interested in the paranormal. My house had activity going on in it before I was ever around, before I was on this planet, and then after I was born, I experienced things on my own, and my friends experienced things whenever they'd come over. So I was always trying to learn as much as I could about the subject and try to figure out, you know, what's going on. I think it helped me to not be afraid of it whenever it was going on if I understood something. Unfortunately, yeah that's not always the case. Sometimes it's just scary. But all that stuff back in the day, you know, you'd go to the library or you'd go to a bookstore and you'd be looking up, you know, books on ghosts and stuff, and every once in a while you'd run across a book that had like Bigfoot stuff in it, or the Lockness Monster. They just kind of put them all together, and that's kind of where I learned about Bigfoot. And then I got a little paperback book about Bigfoot in the Lockness Monster at a yard cell whenever I was a kid, and I read those stories and it had some of the more you know, famous tales in it, you know, like eight Canyon, albert Osman and things like that, and I was like, wow, this is so cool. You know, there's like a monster living in the woods of the Pacific Northwest. And I really didn't think that much about it, honestly. Afterwards, and then years later, I got my first home computer, my first PC, and just exploring the internet, you know, looking stuff up. One night, I typed in the word Bigfoot, and all these websites popped up. I think there was a total of maybe seven where people were going out looking for this thing, and it just blew my mind, and that they actively went out and tried to find it. And there was still like ongoing sightings and stuff of the creature, and it was all over the world. It wasn't just in the Pacific Northwest. And that's really what started it all for me. Did you ever have anything when you started looking? Did you ever get to actually see something? I usually you had some experiences, but did you ever see Yeah? Kind of weird, kind of still looking back on it. It was two thousand and two. I had been going out into the field researching for less than a year. There's no way I should have had a sighting. I was with a group of people. It wasn't really a big Foot outing, but it was a group of researchers. We all got together to have like a camp out and a barbecue in this national park that had a history of sightings, and some people that we were friends with that lived in the area were kind of taking us around to some of the different spots where sidings had happened, where believed activity was taking place on a pretty regular basis, and one of those spots was a parking lot for a nature center, is what they called it. It's basically like a tourist building. You know, people that come into the park can go in this building and get information about the park. You know, they've got brochures and souvenirs and stuff, and they've got a few animals on display that you can find in the area. But whenever this place closes down at night, you've got this empty parking lot and it's nestled in this forest. It's not like on a main highway or anything. And there's trash cans in this parking lot, and supposedly the Bigfoot would raid the trash cans on occasion, people would report driving by the Nature Center parking lot and seeing something big and hary digging in a trash can. So that's where we were. I wasn't really expecting anything. I'm in a parking lot, not my idea surroundings to have a bigfoot siding. And there was a bunch of people there. We had split up into a few different groups and just kind of meandered away from one another into different areas. And there's this guy that I was kind of hanging back with who was using a night vision scope at the time, and he just kind of like, Hey, Matt, come look at this. Tell me if you see what I'm saying. So I walk over there and he hands me the scope and I'm looking through the scope and he's kind of I can see his finger in the scope, kind of pointing where to look, and I see eye shine, these eyes reflecting back and it's just inside the tree line and whatever it is, it's looking at me, and I'm looking at it and I'm trying to process, you know, what is this? What am I looking at? And that's when I realized that those eyes were attached to a face, not an animal's head, but an actual face of some kind of forward looking face. I was, I guess, probably in shock at that time, just staring processing trying to understand what I was looking at. It was an animal, but it didn't look like a person, and at first, you know, the thought crossed my mind, like, are these people like messing me with me? Like? Because I grew up we had a lake house, and we spent all of our free time at that lakehouse. So I grew up hunting and fishing and running around in the woods by myself with my baby gun and a machete, things that kids should not have. And I was fairly knowledgeable about wildlife at this point. You know, I'm in my very early twenties and I've never seen anything. This isn't a bear, this isn't a deer, this isn't an owl in a tree. I see a face, and this face has you know, ford facing eyes. They were kind of almond shaped, set very deep underneath a large brow ridge. It had a very human looking nose. It just didn't have like the nose tip like we have. The nostrils were wide, slightly upturned, but not so much as like what like a gorilla would have, but not as far down as like a human has. The mouth was wide, the lips were thin, The bottom lip was thicker than the top lip. It looked like it had an underbite like that was very pronounced like that stood out a lot to me. The underbite. The jawline was very wide and broad and muscular looking. The outer edges of the jaw were actually sitting out wider than the temples. The hair on this face looked like the same pattern as like if just a human male grew out his facial hair. It was kind of thinner on the cheeks and everything kind of went down into a thicker beard. The hair there wasn't like a forehead. It just kind of started at the brow ridge and just grew back over the top of the head. And there was a tree limb like a branch, cutting across the bottom of its face, and then another one cutting across just over the top of its browridge. So I couldn't see like the bottom of the chin, and I couldn't see the top of the head. And this thing is just staring at me, at least it appears to be staring at me. That's what I'm thinking it's doing. It's looking towards our direction, like it knew we were there, but it's not moving. Every once in a while it would blink. I looked at it through this scope for what seemed like about four or five days, but I'm sure it was like thirty seconds. And I pulled the scope down and I'm looking at him, and I'm like, is that a face? What you know? I can't believe what I'm seeing. And I put it back up to my eye to look at it again, and it's just gone no longer there. There was no sound, no movement, nothing but the area where I had just seen it, the branch that was going across its forehead and the one going across where its chin were. We're now closer together, so I think it was like holding down a branch and like looking through the hole at us, and just took the opportunity whenever I pulled the scope down and looked away to all ass and yeah, my world was rocked at that point. Took forever. I must have spent several months after the fact still trying to like, what could it have been? Is there any way that you know that was somebody in a mask messing with me? And there was just no way. Nobody knew that we were going to be there. There's no way it was a person, Absolutely no way, and definitely changed the course of my research and my outlook on the subject forever. And because of that, here we are having this conversation today. They always say when you see things, it changed your perspective. That's what I say too, because I've always been a skeptic, but when you see something that you can't explain, it really does make you really start to question everything you think you know. Yeah, yeah, for sure. I mean I consider myself a skeptic. I think I became more skeptical after that because I took it way more serious at that point. You know, it wasn't just a story at that point. These things that now I'm coming from the position of I know that they're out there. I know this, this is a fact now, so I have to look at things differently. But at the same time, I know that previous to that, if somebody tells me that they saw a bigfoot, I'm not just like, oh, well, then bigfoot must be real because this person says they saw one. I don't expect anybody to be like that. I don't expect people to be like that whenever they hear me talk about what I saw in my experiences, and I'm okay with that. I think everybody should be that way, because the truth of the matter is people can be mistaken, and people do make up stories all the time. And it's something like other things out there, whether it's the paranormal UFOs, Bigfoot, whatever, it's something that I know you have to experience for yourself before you can actually believe that it's real, because otherwise, how can you accept that that you've just been living a life. Whether there's these monsters out there that aren't supposed to exist and somehow they've managed to elude us for so long, and all these things are going on all around us and they're not supposed to be there. It's a lot to deal with, the struggle I have when it comes to believing encryptids and everything else. And this is coming from someone who saw something you kind of just alluded to a little bit. How are these things out there and they're so large and yet only a few people ever detect them. You don't really have any great footage besides the Patterson given them. There's such a big debate on it, if that's real or not. I kind of lean towards it's real, just because when you see muscles moving and other things, it looks a lot better. And no one's ever produced a suit that I thought looked like that, Like, I know someone's come out, so they've made the suit, and they've been several people, but they've never leave. It never really added up to me. But when you go into it, the one question that always comes back to there would have to be enough for a breeding population. If they're a less and blood type of a creature. There's also have to be the food sources. There has to be where they're at. How Comes no one's ever ran one over, how Comes, no one's ever had a body like. There's always a questions, there's more questions and answers, And that's where most people that are skeptical can say these things don't exist because for whatever reason, there's been no proof. So that's where I come into with my skepticism as well, there's no proof. What are people seeing? I don't believe everything is misidentification because what you just said is you know it's not a bear, you know it's not another type of animal, so what could it be? And that's where you come back to is like is everyone making things up? Because what's what does anyone get out of making stuff up? Internet clout cool? Yeah, I mean that's the million dollar question. Why isn't there any proof? And you know, different things. There's there's responses. You can argue either side of it. Honestly, you could argue that, well, there's no way that there's enough for a breeding population. But then you could also argue, well, there's like, you know, if you compare numbers of like I mean, we'll say black bear in the United States, where there's just thousands and thousands and thousands of them, how often do you actually see them? Right, especially if you live in a city like most people do and don't really go out into the woods all that often. And if you do go out into the woods, it's for you know, a week in camping trip with your family, you're on vacation or whatever. You're going in campgrounds that are heavily popular and everything. Not very many people spend a lot of time in the back country, and most people live their entire lives without ever seeing a bear, even if they live in an area that has ten thousand bears, So the number could be large enough for a breeding population in my opinion, without them hardly ever being seen, especially if you consider that these things are very intelligent. We're not talking about just an animal. There's a lot of speculation involved in that, but I would say the general consensus, if you're a bless and blood person, is that these things are a primate and they appear to be extremely intelligent, so that gives them an advantage certainly not having hit one or produced a body some sort of specimen. Well, you know, there's stories out there. There's a lot of stories of them being shot. There's a lot of stories of a potential cover up going on, or at least to the extent that the government doesn't want to admit that they're out there, and we'll do things to the fact that they are, like confiscating bodies and things like that. But those are all just stories. It's all just part of the folklore. At the end of the day. Don't know have no idea that that's one of the things that I've had to face. Why haven't we Because even with those things on the table, and I have been confident in my Bigfoot journey, in my arguments on the side of explaining why we don't find bones, this and that. But at the end of the day, there's still that question. Okay, with all that being said, you know, humans are pretty lucky. We've gotten some pretty incredible photographs and videos of they are very difficult to acquire. Why hasn't you know, a truck or late one night hit one on a logging road somewhere. Why hasn't a hunter just walked across a dead one land there? At some point you have to ask what's really going on? You know, why haven't we gotten that proof yet? There are reasons why that could possibly be the answer, But then there's also a lot of unknowns out there, and at the end of the day, we might not be as smart as we think we are, and we might be dealing with something else entirely. There's a lot of opinions and speculation and everything. There's never been anything concrete or conclusive for whatever you want to say. But if you go the flesh and blood route, and you can use you use Baar for an example, Think about how many hunters go out there, and you can ask a lot of hunters how often have they ever came across a carcass of a dead bear? Yeah, happened very often. Same thing with a mountain lion. Now, if you're dealing with something that has high intelligence and some believe that they bury their dead, I can get behind that. So you're not going to see something that they bury their dead. But there's been times, just from the field of what I do for work, we build highways, we build roads, we start excavating grounds, and we've come across bones, our animals and this and that. At some point, with all the way the world has been ripped apart because we continue to expand where humans live, wouldn't we've come across bones? And then I know there's stories of the giants or whatever people wanted to call them where they've had bones discovered. Are those really things? I have no idea. I mean, again, it's all just folklore, but there's been stories of giants and other things like that. Well, if there's giants and they're calling them giants, wouldn't that also qualify towards a possible sasquatch because you're just looking at bones, and back in those days, I don't think anyone was an anthropologists and know what it exactly was what they're looking at. Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, you know that's one of the things that's always kind of interested me is how we visualized dinosaurs, for instance, based on their skeletons. We could be completely wrong. I mean, if you look at like the skeleton of a hippo, you're gonna get a completely different creature than what it actually looks like. Yeah, and if you take the average person who's not an anthropologist and you stick them in a scenario, let's just say that family that went on vacation and went camping for the weekend, Well, let's go for a hike. Oh, I've got to take a piss. I'm gonna step off trail here and take a leak. Oh man, here's some bones that must be a deer or a bear or something. Look, honey, I found the skeleton of like a bear or something. Isn't that cool? All right, let's go. I mean, bones could have been found and nobody had even recognized them for what they are, because it's highly unlikely that you would run across any sort of like complete skeleton or anything like that, and most people wouldn't even know what they were looking at anyway, So it doesn't really matter. So I don't think it's totally out of the realm. The possibility that people have stumbled across bones and things like that and just not even known what they were seeing. I also think it's possible that people have had encounters with these things, and because they're not knowledgeable on low wildlife or being out in the woods or anything like that, they just write it off as a bear or something explainable, because why would it be a bigfoot. That's ridiculous. Some of the things I think about are when people say they're walking and they hear like footsteps, Well, again, that could be anything, because you're in the woods, right, And the things that get to me because when something's been thrown at them. If you're out in the woods and a rock comes flying at you, I don't know of any type of normal woodland animal that picks up a rock and throws it. I don't think a bear can throw a rock. They say there's tree knocks. I mean, I've heard random noises. I'm not gonna say it was a bigfoot because I know what you're thinking is a knock could just be something else, like a woodpecker. Sometimes it's not like a knock just depends on where it's at and how it echoes through the place. But I've never experienced anything because I'm not one that ever goes out in the woods look for stuff. I used to back when I was a kid, we used to go out in the woods all the time. Up in my friend's house. There's a cabin that we found out in the woods one time too, and we went out there and did stuff the teenagers would go out and do that will not talk about on air. But and there was this old book, yeah, the Necronomicon. But no, we we used to go out all the time. And I never once ever, as a kid, ever thought about running into a sasquatch or a big foot or whatever out in the woods like we're walking. My biggest thing was running into like people. That was like, you never know who're gonna run out too in these woods so creep out here. Nowadays, I like, I don't know what I'm gonna run into anyway, said, I'm not even worry about the people these days. Yeah, whenever I was running around in the woods, there was one incident in hindsight that was really weird. At least it was weird to me. But I never thought about, you know, sasquatch being out there or anything like that. I think you know, I might have used my imagination to think about wherewolves a time or two and scare myself, but that was about it. But there was one time whenever I was in an area that I had never been before. I was pretty deep in the woods and everything went quiet, and that scared me. And I was just standing there and then something large, I don't know what it was, took off right next to me. There was kind of a little clearing there and some like really tall grass, about four or five foot tall, and something was in that grass and just hauled it away from me. I don't know what it was. I just always assumed it was a deer, which probably that's what it was. But other than that, it never really crossed my mind, even whenever I was like reading stuff on it, the idea that there was bigfoot living right there. It was just unheard of. You know, I'm not in Washington or Oregon or you know, Canada or anything. There's no bigfoot in Oklahoma. That's ridiculous. And that's where my siding took place, was in Oklahoma. So really had no clue. But what's interesting about what you said is the night before the siding, we had gone into a different area, and there was rocks being thrown from the woods over our heads into the creek behind us. And at first, like I heard the splashing and everything, and I thought, well, that's it's probably just some fish, you know, even though the creek where we were at was only like six inches deep, still a possibility. I'm just going to assume it's nighttime, there's bugs landing on the water. Fish. I'm used to it. But then you started seeing like the you know, you'd be looking up in the air because it was happening so much, and you actually see a rock fly over your head and splashing the creek behind you. I mean, what do you do with that? So I'm standing there, uh, leaned up against this car hood, talking to my friend. We're facing the tree line, the tree lines just on the other side of the car, so maybe ten feet away, and this rock about the size of like a small marble, hits the hood of the car, bounces up, hits me in the stomach, and falls back down the hood of the car right in front of me. And I was just like, okay, what, what the hell? Like, there's what throws rocks that? And that blew my mind. And that was the kind of the turning point for me where I was like, holy crap. Either somebody parked on the highway and hiked multiple miles through the dark in the woods without a flashlight to come throw rocks at us, and somehow knew that we would be in this location, Like nothing out there can throw rocks except for a person. And this isn't like a situation where like, oh, it could have been a bird or a squirrel. It wasn't coming from above. The trajectory hit the car hood and it bounced and hit me. So it came from the trees now, And like you could hear rocks like zipping through the leaves and stuff of the trees. How they threw a rock through the woods without hitting trees, that one is still a mistree to me, I don't understand. But even that, like the next night, I have that sighting and I realized, even as much as I thought I believe these things were real, at that point, I had no clue. It was a whole different level, Like it changes you. How big would you say it was when you were looking at it? How tall do you think? Well, so that area, after I had that sighting, one of the locals there the same guy that I had been talking to the night before whenever the rock hit me. This park is right at the edge of this small town, and he lived in this town for years and years. His family was from there, and he and I became really close friends, and he became like my research partner. It is about three and a half hours from where I live now, so it wasn't that far for me to travel, and I knew him, and I met other people down there that I could stay with. So I was like, well, I've had a sighting here, I know they're here, so I'm just going to focus my efforts there. Why should I waste my time traveling around trying to find them blindly whenever I know there's at least one in this area. So that's where I started researching it. So that spot, I mean, I've been to it hundreds of times now, you know. I've gone and like stood at the area where it was and everything and retraced the steps and everything. So that particular spot from where I was, it would have probably been in the range of six to seven feet not out of the realms of like a human by any means, but I mean I'm six foot one and typically I'm taller or one of the taller people in any given group. There's really not that many people that go above six foot tall, so again it's like the odds of it being a person. They would have been taller than me and just randomly having a bigfoot mask. I mean, everybody from my group was accounted for, so I don't know. I still think about it. There was another incident that took place in the same area where I saw something else that was much larger, but it was it stayed in the confines of the darkness. I didn't have a night vision scope or anything, so all I saw was basically a silhouette in the dark. But if that was one that one would have been upwards of like ten feet tall. It was massive. There was like a hiking trail, so you had, you know, all the limbs and everything cleared out, and it's this opening of a trail, however wide a hiking trail is, and whatever this thing was, it blocked the view entirely of the hiking trail behind it, like I could not see past it. So it was every bit as wide as the trail. And I had a buddy of mine who was about five foot four or five foot six at the time, not a real tall guy. But I had him go stand in the area where this silhouette was, and there was this tree limb above him, and this thing it looked like its head was kind of duck down below it, like it was kind of holding its head down, And this tree limb was about two of him high whenever I looked at him, So that tree limb would have been around the ten foot mark a little bit more maybe, and this thing's head, if that's what it was, was just right below that tree limb. I can't even comprehend how something that large can just be around, you know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I thought there's like, how how can and not just one? But like you were saying, you know, there's more than one. Even if even if you're talking about if you don't think flesh and blood, if you go the route of you think these things are interdimensional portal hoppers whatever, even that belief still acknowledges that there's groups of them and that they at least can manifest physically if they want to. So how does something like that even like move around in the woods, you know, Because like the thing I was looking at was four feet wide easily, and if you're walking through the thick timber, like, you know, that's kind of difficult as a human with a normal sized human. So like, I mean, I don't know, man, I don't have any idea. That's kind of you know. That's where I start having a few issues trying to understand the stuff, especially whenever people start talking about you know, I saw one that was, like, you know, twenty feet tall, and I'm like, dude, you could see that from Google, Like are you kidding me? Like do you actually know how tall twenty feet is? And like how wide that thing would Like it wouldn't be able to maneuver, It couldn't walk, it couldn't hunt, it couldn't do anything, like it'd be eating cattle or something like. That's insanely large. But whenever you hear things plowing through the woods, you know, snapping limbs and breaking stuff as it comes, I mean, it sounds like an elephant. It sounds like a bulldozer coming through there. So I don't know, man, I don't know. I'm with you, though, How does something that big just exist out there without being seen all the freaking time? You look at animals right now, what we know exists. The largest animals are like the elephant. I don't know anything in like a giraffe obviously, but that's all nick. So when you go into this like size wise, I can't think of anything taller, any thing that's bigger. Obviously it lives in the water. Yeah, that's not out walking around, right, And then I forget what it's called. But I know there's like the scientific law of whatever or size or same. But basically, the bigger something is, the more gravity it has, the harder it is for it to be of that size. Right. I've seen people saying that they've seen fifteen foot bigfoot. Again, like you said twenty, does anyone know how tall that really is? I have a nine foot metal cutout of one out of my pullbarn out back, and that looks huge on my pole barn. Can you imagine almost doubling that? Yeah, it's insane. One of the first things we ever did it was on my first real bigfoot outing. It was done in Texas, and like the first day I was there, we went outside with a tap measure on a tree and we marked ten feet on the tree just so everybody could get an idea of what ten feet look, And I mean I've you know, played basketball and stuff. I know what a basketball goal is. Yeah, and uh, but whenever you're standing there looking up at ten feet marked on the side of the tree, that's insane, man, that's insane. That's that's looking. That's standing flat foot at the side of your house and being able to look on the roof. Yep, that's crazy. I used to have that cut out out on my front right by the house, so literally the top of it was right over the edge of the roof. Yeah, so that I said, I think it's nine feet, so imagine tenv you're another foot above that. Yeah, So just imagine walking through the woods and coming across something ten foot, Like there's no way someone's not going to shift themselves. Just yeah. I mean, like that definitely explains why you get some of the reactions from people. You get, you know, whenever they've had a sighting. My friend had a siding. He was he was a complete skeptic man, my best friend. And uh, he went on and outing with me down in Texas, and he was going because he was my best friend and he was worried because I'm going out in the woods looking for an imaginary creature with a bunch of strangers. So he's gonna go and bust this thing wide open and talk sense in to me and all that. And we go down there, and I mean, just the chain of events alone, like we're it's just me and him the whole car ride there, all we know is directions to the campground where everybody's meeting up at. Before we get to the campground, we're driving down this road and I'm like, man, that looks like a good area we should go check out later. Because it was just a wooded area and it had a dirt road that just went off in there. Couldn't see where it went or anything, but it was right next to a spillway at a dam, so it had like water running through there and everything, and it just looked boogery as they call it. But it was like a totally random thing. As we're driving down the road. So we get to the campground and eventually we start talking about like, well we should go look for a place, you know, we should go see if we can stir something up. And I'm like, hey, we on our way here, we drove by this road. We should go check it out. So that's where we ended up going and I mean we had enough people where we had two cars, and in my car it was me and my friend and two other guys, and then everybody else was in the other vehicle. Well, you follow this road and it kind of snakes around in there, and eventually you end up at a position where the road curves off to the right and goes on down about another quarter mile or so to a dead end. But there's also like a dead end spot right there. Well, it turns out this area is actually a public hunting area and these are access points for hunters. Didn't know that at the time or anything, but there's no vehicles down there or anything. This happened in October, so right around deer season is getting started and everything. But like I said, that's why the gates were actually open. I learned later they opened them for hunters during deer season, but otherwise they stay close. So I pulled in and I backed my vehicle in, and I'm right next to the tree line, and there's this little clearing on the other side of my vehicle, and then just the woods wraps around us, and there's the dirt road that we came in on, going straight in front of us, and the other vehicle curved with the road on around to the right and went on down to the dead end. We get out of the car, and I mean, as soon as we shut the doors, you start hearing something running around in the woods right next to us, just instantly, and we're all like, hey, be quiet, you know, listen, what's that? And you can hear something moving around out there, don't know what it is. We decided to get the lights. Usually we stayed all dark, but we had spotlights with us if need be. And so we're getting spotlights out of the vehicle. I had already walked on a ways on the other side of the road to get away from everybody so I could hear better. And my friend gets a spotlight out of the back of the car and starts shining the spotlight around. The other two guys walk down the road a little kind of separating. My friend starts saying, I've got eye shine. I've got eye shine, and we're like, okay, you know, like lots of animals out here. Man, this is like literally his first time in the woods. But I noticed he keeps like his voice, you know, the anxiety in his voice is picking up and he keeps, I've got ice shine, guys, I got it. He's starting to get a little nervous, so we all kind of start walking back towards him, and I get in on my side of the vehicle to get another spotlight, and I close the door and I'm walking back towards the front of my vehicle to go around over to the tree side where he's at. All of a sudden, he screams, this is a dude in his mid twenties. Okay. He screams like a little kid and takes off running around the vehicle, almost knocks two of us over. He through the spotlight. He jumps inside the car, crawls over into the back seat and is like down in the seat, like just hysterical, absolutely hysterical, and we're like, what the hell, man, what the hell? Start shining the spotlight around. I'm worried about him, but like, what did he see? And I caught a glimpse in the spotlight beam through the trees of something that looked like the side of an arm and like part of a rib cage and maybe the top part of a hip as something upright. It was kind of rusting, colored like dead pine needles. Just running through this gap in the spotlight beam. So we're all shining the spotlight. Something's going on. Then I realized, you know, like wait, my friend like he's still freaking out. He he wasn't just getting in the car to be saved. He's like inside the car yelling. Now. So I get in the car and I'm like, dude, calm down, what's wrong. He's like, take me home, take me back home, Take me home, Take me home. So the other two guys there's still spotlight and stuff out in the woods. I can hear them yelling and stuff. Something's going on. They're trying to get in the vehicle. I'm trying to start the vehicle. The doors are automatically locking. I turned the car on. Complete chaos. Now. One of them's like drawing his gun and I'm just like, oh my god, what is happening. And so they get back in the vehicle. I get the doors unlocked and everything. We radio the other people and we're like, hey, you guys need to come down here. Something's going on. The other group comes. We all get back out of the vehicles. My friend is still in hysterics. He's not talking, he is trembling, he's crying. I've never seen him like this. It took probably an hour or so for him to calm down enough to where like he was relaxed enough to talk. He wouldn't get out of the vehicle. What had happened was he was shining that spotlight around and he saw reflexion of eyes and he just saw them like dart behind a tree. He didn't see what it was or anything, and so he's like shining the spotlight around and then in the edge of the beam he sees eyes shine again, and he said it was about a foot or so off the ground, and it was like something was leaning out from behind this tree. So he shines the spotlight back over there, trying to catch it real fast, and the eyes dart back behind the tree. And he said he was just shining it at this tree trunk, and then all of a sudden, this thing he sees first a hand, a giant hand, hairy arm reach around the trunk of the tree and grab it. And then this hair covered thing that he said, the only thing he's ever seen even remotely close to what it looks like is Chewbacca leans out directly into the spotlight and he's just blasting it in the face with the spotlight, and whenever he saw that, that's when he screamed through the spotlight and ran into the car. I've always wondered if I were to react the same way, just because I always make comments and jokes and I'm going to be the idiot that gets killed by a bigfoot or whatever I see, because I'm going to be the person that runs after it. Everyone runs the other direction or they freeze or whatever, like, I'm going to be the one chasing after And I said, ione do it on Facebook live stream like that, there's a proof of the world. I'm here live streaming me get ripped apart by a sasquatch. But I don't know. I don't know how people can really react. And you can't really predict how you're going to react, because no, you can't. When you see something like that, you're like, it blows your mind because as much as you want to believe and you think it's out there, the moment you actually see it and it confirms everything, and then your whole world is just like minds loading a mooji. I guess like something else. I mean, I had been doing the bigfoot stuff online and like talking to people about it, you know, nightly, we could get into this like voice chat every night and talk. I had been doing all that for like months and months and months before I ever actually went out and met up with them and went into the woods. And I had gone out with them a few times, and at the point where I had my sighting, I was with friends at that point in my mind, you know, like I knew these people. I was out there actively looking for them. I was looking at a face at a safe distance, you know, maybe thirty yards or so at the most I've got. I'm looking at through night vision. So there's that mental separation between reality. You know, if I take the night vision scope down, I don't see it anymore. It's not there. He however, he's a skeptic to the point of a non believer. He thinks we're all crazy. He thinks his best friends in danger because these people have to be completely off their rocker. These things don't exist. It's ridiculous. And then one staring him in the face from ten to fifteen feet away. It traumatized him, man, it absolutely traumatized him. He was shook for the rest of the outing. He eventually got out of the car hours later, but he didn't leave the car. He stayed leaning up against it. He wouldn't walk away from the vehicle. And eventually he did go back out in the woods with me, but it took months for me to talk him into going back out there because at that point I was like, dude, you had a sighting. You know they're here, come on, you know. And he's like, man, I don't want I don't want nothing to do with it. And he's Native American, so there's also you know, some Native American beliefs and stuff going on there where, Like his grandma especially, is like you leave those things alone, you don't go looking for him, So he didn't want to have anything to do with it. He did eventually get a tattoo of one on his arm to commemorate the event that changed his life. But yeah, man, you don't know how you're going to react. And I don't think because you react one way one time, you would react the same way another time. I think it depends on the situation and how the person is at the time and a lot of factors, and it can have a very different impact on a different person. But regardless of how you react, the way that it changes things in you internally. I mean that happens to everybody. If you have a sighting and you know what you saw, you can't go back. Man, you can't close that door once it's open. No, it's almost like Pandora's box. Once it's out, it's out. That's uh. I'll dive into that one. I talk to you in your episode, but uh, it's definitely one of those things to where when you get into it, you experience it. Even though you want to not believe in it, it still eats at you like to try and rationalize and understand what it was you saw. Yeah, I don't think people ever really bring that up that often, like they said, oh I saw this and this. It does have an impact on people, and even I've said this about other podcasters and other things too, and that's probably why some people don't like me. But a lot of people don't take into consideration how it impacts other people. Everyone might see it differently, and if you're someone that has never had any experience before, or you cannot relate to someone who has, whether they say it or not, like it is not the same people say, oh you have PTSD. I don't like throwing that out there like that's not what it is, But it's each person deals with their own things differently, And I don't like when people are just out there left and right trying to force people in talk about someone wants to talk about it, grave they don't want to talk about it, you leave them alone. Yeah, Like everyone has to deal with it their own way. And then there's other things out there to where are these people really experience it? The ones that come out there and make up all these BS stories, they're not helping anyone, no, not at all. It literally just puts worse stigma on the whole situation for people that actually have seen something. So it's kind of a hard thing to get through when you hear some of these fantastical stories are getting tossed around. And then when people say, oh, you saw some of the lots boring, I'm sorry, like you my encounter was not exciting for you, I guess, like whatever, So I don't know it's doing. This has really opened my eyes to more of what other people have experienced, more so than what I ever really thought because I didn't know people were having all these encounters. Like I used to watch Finding big Foot when it came out and I literally laughed at the show because I thought it was kind of dumb, just because it seems so staged. And I've never spoken to any of the people involved with the show, but anything on television I feel like a stage. There's Mountain Monsters. They claim those guys are really awesome guys. I've been asked to have a couple of the guys come on the show and talk to me. Sometimes, I'd love to talk to them. Mountain Monsters is one hundred percent fictional, yeah, and that's what I say to people. I was like, that show is one hundred percent over the top stupidity, like it's for pure dumb entertainment. Yeah. I think some of the guys are actually interested in the subject and stuff and maybe have even had experiences. But I mean I know people that know them personally who then matter of fact, we tell you like, yeah, no, that's written, it's all fake, Like it's just for entertainment. That's where I struggle with though, when you see the things on TV, because TV is a completely different facet of entertainment, people claim that podcast are entertainment. I didn't see it that way, but I mean, I guess it is, But I wasn't out here to make entertainment. I'm not out here trying to produce fake stuff, you know what I mean? Yeah, I mean, you've got documentaries and you've got action movies. They're both films, but they're entirely different. And unfortunately, it seems that more people are interested in the action and horror movies that are interested in the documentaries. And there's a lot of people podcasters and you know, people that go on podcasts that realize that, and so that's that's you know, their profession. They are one entertainment and they put those view counts before putting real information out there. You know. I've struggled a lot with that personally as a podcaster, as a former researcher, as a person who's had a sighting. And then I have a podcast that's based on witnesses coming on and telling their stories. You know, I don't judge them. I don't get into arguments with them about whether I believe them or not. I don't, you know, hold their feet to the fire and grill them on their details, trying to expose them in a lie or anything like that. I approach it completely different than I had approached it. If I was doing it as like an actual investigation where I'm interviewing a witness, I consider it a form of entertainment. I consider it modern folklore. You know, these are the stories, and I wanted to provide not only just a platform for people to be able to come on and share their stories without being attacked, because that was something that was going on heavily back in the day, but also I was coming from a background where I was always just these things are flesh and blood. If you're saying they cloaked, or you're saying you know it turned into an orb or mind spoke with you, you're making shit up. That's a lie. They don't do that. I had no reason to believe that they did that. But then at the same time I didn't know that they don't do that. I was being a jackass about it, you know, and I had to do a lot of self reflection and think about, well, think about all the paranormal experiences you've had, Think about why you're here to begin with. You know, your your interest in ghosts because your house was haunted and you were a little kid and you were scared at night. There's none of that makes scientific sense, like there's nothing that you've experienced that you should expect anybody to believe is true because scientifically, you know, it's never been proven. So why are you shutting the door on those people? They have a voice. They you know that even from a scientific approach, that's still data that needs to be documented, whether it's true, whether it's not, it still needs to be entered. And I wanted to provide a platform where I allowed people to freely share their experiences, regardless of what those experiences were. And so that's what I did. Now that's literally same thing I do here. It's I'm not here to prove or do is prove anyone. They want to come on here and talk about their experiences. That's what I'm here for. And there's a lot at the times that people have come on here and I've questioned if I believe it or not, because again I'm a skeptic, and I've told people that straight up, like I don't have to believe what you're telling me just because it might not make sense to me. But I'm not saying you're wrong. But I'm not going to argue with anyone about it either, because I don't know I wasn't. Yeah, who am I to tell somebody that they didn't experience what they say they experienced exactly? And I've had people tell me that about my own stuff. I was like, and efort, were you sitting there? Yeah? Were? You were right there with them when all us went down. You were right there with me, like you were there when you're with us, Like, there's no way, So Ho's someone going to criticize someone else when they weren't there to see it themselves. And that's why I'd said I do what I do because I feel like from being personally in their situation of being ridiculed, being laughed at, being whatever, no one has a place to talk about stuff like otherwise you looked at like you're freaking crazy. So yeah, I mean I've told people, I've told people that have come on the show that look, I'm getting something out of this too, beyond the realm of a view or a download or whatever. It's helping me cope with what I experienced. It's helping me understand the things that I experienced, And it is so refreshing to be able to talk to somebody else who has had a similar experience or has gone through the emotional process that you've gone through in the situation, and just knowing that, like, not everybody out there is going to roll their eyes. Not everybody out there thinks you're crazy, and there are a small number of individuals on this planet that can actually relate to what you experienced, and that is a huge help to people that have gone through this sort of thing. Now, I've even said to like, don't take everything I say is the truth, as in I questioned my own sanity when it comes to my own experience. I've looked every single way I can to rationalize it, and I said, maybe I'm mistaken, Like that makes more so that trying to discredit my own self just because part of me doesn't want to accept that. And I don't know why I do that, but it is what it is. And I look at towards other people too. It's like, I'm not here to tell someone that what the guests come on here says is one hundred percent accurate. There could be the human mind has a way of coping, and you have traumatic events, and some people their brains function a way to shield them from some certain things. And I've said this before with alien abductions. What if the aliens didn't come in your room at night and did things too. What if it's something else in your brain has now processed that into alien you know what I mean? Yeah, for covering up a traumatic event from an early childhood and you've manifested aliens as the ones that abused you. There was a person that came on my podcast and we were talking about their experiences with some possible UFO stuff, and at one point in the interview it got to an area where I was just like, do you think that you've been abducted by aliens? And they said that they think they have, And just immediately I said, I no longer feel comfortable about discussing that. I don't feel that that's in an area where I even need to be messing with that. That requires somebody that knows a lot more about things than I do, because people do cover up things like trauma, and people also are traumatized by things that they're not covering up but trying to process it and everything. So that's a very dangerous area to get into, you know, the psychology behind the events and everything. You know you were talking about earlier PTSD. I also don't like throwing PTSD out there. I would never put this in the same line as like, say, a veteran who actually suffers from PTSD, right in my mind, it's completely different. But there's definitely some people are definitely psychologically effective for the rest of their lives after experiencing some of these things, and rightfully so, you know, you're having reality ripped apart right before your eyes, and you're in a situation where you've experienced something and you feel completely isolated and alone because the vast majority of the planet doesn't believe you or wouldn't believe you, and they'd think something was wrong with you if you ever told them about it. And that's the part that I think needs to go away. You know that I'm trying to help, and you know people like you are trying to help. Trying everybody is the stigma behind it. Yeah, yeah, not everybody is in this just for the reason of cashing in or you know, having these big, fantastical stories. I think somebody seeing a bigfoot crossed the road in front of them is just as important and worthy of hearing as somebody who says one kicked in their door and dragged them out of bed. You know, I've heard some pretty entertaining ones that lately that I'm not going to bring up because everyone will know exactly who I'm talking about. But there is a lot of stories. I will use the word stories and this so I know it bothers people if I say stories. But these to me are stories because like I just I'm not saying they're lying. But there are way too many Hollywood moments into some of these. Some stories seem harder to believe than others for me personally, but I also know as a podcaster, as anybody who is in the public eye, it is very easy, especially whenever it comes to topics like Bigfoot in the paranormal and UFOs two really fall into a bolt type mentality where I know that I have the ability if I wanted to, which I never would, but I could push my own personal beliefs on different subjects through my show and my audience. The people that listen to me regularly, a good portion of them would start having those same opinions, and they would start defending those opinions publicly. They'd start attacking people that didn't agree with those opinions. I've seen it happen time and time and time again, which is another thing that skeptics often do is compare these beliefs and stuff to religion and cults, and it's because it's true. There's a lot of that type mentality, that type of behavior that exist in these areas. I've said recently that the crypt did communities just from in this podcasting realm, they're very cult like just because you have specific shows and other things like and you have their followers and their listeners and everything else. They look towards these people that do the shows and they believe everything these people say. And if you look at it as an outsider, because I don't consider myself a podcaster, this is all new to me, and I'm very observant as a person. So I'm like, I guess I'm gonna creep the hangs out in the back with my arms crossing, keeps eyeing on what's going on, and watches everyone else's behaviors or whatever. But that's how I've always been. That's even what I do for a living, and I notice things, and I see things, and it's just like there's a lot of cult vibes within these communities, and not even just this, but like even in the music scene, like they're very cult like vibes, tribalism, whatever you want to call it. And there's a lot of gatekeeping. Yeah I don't get it, I really don't. But to each his own, Like I'm not going to go down that beaten on that war drum and get a anseled today. But you know, no, but it's true. It's it's definitely true. I mean there's and I've seen it forever. You know, It's not just this area like you're saying, it's any area where there's any sort of paras social activities going on where people feel like they are connected to whoever. You know, they feel like they have to believe the way they believe, talk the way they talk, dress the way they dress, act the way they act, and they feel that anybody that has an opinion that goes against that person, that they have to defend that person, They have to defend them entirely. I mean, ICP comes to mind for some reason Juggalos. I was about to think in Juggalos, but it does line up with that. And I'll just throw this out there. I used to be a big fan of ICP back when I was like fourteen, so back back in like the mid nineties, so I wouldn't say I was a juggalo, But there there is a video floating around me and my best friend painted up as the ICP guy's lip syncing to Oh there you go. Those are before the internet days of YouTube or TikTok or whatever. So if I ever find that video, I'll make sure to become a famous play it. Yeah, no, there is a I just want everyone, and I know it's wishful thinking it will never happen, but I just wish for everyone to just not be so And I don't know what the proper term to be would without offending anyone. Yeah, like there isn't one. Yeah, just to be good people. Well, calm down. Yeah, Like there is enough room for what we're doing. There's enough room in general for any type of quote unquote entertainment that it doesn't have to be the way it is. And I think if everyone could understand that, things would be a lot better. But for some reason, I think a lot of things. Actually, some people enjoy that that is their entertainment, Oh for sure. So again, it's a it's a platform for whatever when anyone wants to do. I'm not saying it's wrong. I'm not saying it's right. I don't really care what anyone else does, but I think it does more harm than good. But that's just my opinion. And you know what, my opinion doesn't mean anything. I'm a guy with a microphone. Yeah, same, same. At the end of the day, nobody's opinions matterr Nope, not at least not past an individual level. You know, I don't care if somebody listens to my podcast and they're just like, and this dude's full of shit, I hate them. That's fine. You're free to listen to whatever you want to. I don't get mad if somebody that listens to my show listens to somebody else's show. I don't care if they listen to somebody else that I don't even like, it's fine. There's room for everybody. Yep, that is. And I'm not a big podcast person. I don't listen to a whole lot of stuff. I recently started listening to your stuff when we started talking, because I was I never really knew much about you, so I was like, well, I'm gonna look into your show, and I've been listening to the last four or five episodes when I get a chance. But I don't have a whole lot of free time to listen to podcasts. I'm either doing my own show, or I'm working, or I'm doing stuff with my family. I don't have the three hours a day driving like I used to, so I don't have that free time to be listening to the podcasts. And there's I'm friends with several other podcasters, so I try and keep up with everyone that I talk to show. But I also don't like listening to podcasts because I don't want to emulate someone, you know what I mean, Like, I don't want to be like yeah, yeah, subconsciously influenced by what they're doing. Like I'd rather just be my own stupidity. I guess I don't know, but yeah, I think we can probably wrap this one up. I do want you to let everyone know again where they can check you out at find your podcasts, what I've been up to. I would assume anywhere you find tinfoil tels, you can find Bigfoot Crossroads. No, there's always Bigfoot Crossroads dot Com, you know, Spotify, Apple, all those good things. YouTube, anywhere you look, you'll probably find it. It's not hard to find. You type in Bigfoot and it's one of the first ones to pop up, so finally, Yeah, I noticed that because I use Apple, I typed in Bigfoot and then there's several of pop But you were one of the first ones that was on there, so you've you've made it on Apples. Yes, good thing. I didn't call it Sasquatch Crossroads. Yeah, there's a few of those that might be it might be a little touchy on that one. Yeah. Well, I appreciate you taking the time to come on here today and talk with me. We've been chatting back and forth, so it's nice to actually sit down and have a conversation that's not words on a screen. Yeah. Yeah, I've enjoyed it. It's nice to be on the other side every once in a while. Yeah, I said that too. I don't go on too many shows. I've been on a few here and there, but it's strange for me because I don't want to be the center of attention. You don't like to talk, you don't want to be the center of attention. Started a podcast, good job and used to be a front man. He used to be a front man. Yeah, everyone, I mean, maybe I'm the walking hypocrite. I don't know. I just yeah, I don't know. I guess if anyone knows me for the outside of this, I'm pretty quiet, nonchalant, like people have conversations. I'll just sit there all day and never say or unless someone speaks to me like That's not like I don't interject myself. I'm like, oh, what's your opinion on this? And then I'll talk for like forty five minutes. You're like, this dude never shuts up. Why did I ask him that? No? Why did he get so self lothingly preachy at me? Well, Matt again, it's been a pleasure. Everyone. Check out Bigfoot Crossroads. Wherever you listen to tenfoil Tels you can find it there too. So again, thanks to Matt, and thanks for listening. Remember the truth, lies, and the stories we share, the connections we make, stay curious, stay open minded. Thank you all for joining us on this journey. And until next time, keep questioning, keep seeking, and keep exploring. The EndNote All night everyone,