Ep. 260: The Presence: Bigfoot, UFOs, and the Intelligence Behind the Mystery

And I just turned around and I call ass out of there. I was done. I wasn't deal with them. The hypocrisy of the cult is one of the things that turned me away the quickest. When I turned my head lights on, it turned and looked at us. And one of the things I remember the most, where the eyes were going red. I see an orb of light. It is just circling these steps like it is waiting for me. And he begins to tell them that he saw a UFO. They're basically like, what are you talking about. That's seven foot up on a tree, peeking around it, and that's where I saw the top of the muzzle, nose and the eyes. As soon as I made eye contact with this thing, I don't like death. Welcome back to tin Foil Tells. I'm your host Brandon Tonight, I'm joined by Ron and Mark. Guys, thanks for coming here and talking with me. Thanks for having us. It doesn't matter to me who goes first, But would you guys like to let the audience know a little bit about yourself before we dive into it tonight. I'll go ahead. Mark. I'm a writer of science fiction and fantasy. I'm seventy five years old. I live in Bulder, Colorado. I got my start in writing with Ron Meyer, the co author on this book, The High Strangeness of Bigfoot, about thirty years ago. He mentored me and as he and I have worked together on numerous projects, thousands of projects in the last thirty years. I practice a martial art called aketo and uh I live in a live in a community that that the residents manage and uh we, uh we do a pretty good job of it. I think that's about that's my that's my tail. Mhm. So I've been in the entertainment business, starting in public television in the seventies. Then they got a company and was in the rise of cable producing and distributing. Did the first feature film for Discovery with you know, Hollywood actors, billion dollar budgets. Turn of the century. I sold my library and focused on producing, largely for one company being educational material and the other one doing edutainment where I got a specialty and serial killers of all things. And I was hired to do a program on Bigfoot pre COVID and I wasn't too excited about it. I really had no idea about Bigfoot, but my daughter, who was working for me at the time said you would largely handle the hard work, and so that's how I got into the paranormal. Other than that, I've been involved in anomalous experiences throughout my life, including not doing experiences where the self goes away, out of body experiences, and lately I've been we've been recording with a particular protocol we use that we call it the C six protocol who we use a mindfulness meditation and a rare old chant from the beginning of natural languages, and we're beginning all sorts of weird recordings, appearances and even whatever I was doing, it took control of a bunch of environmental variables, including the magnetism of an area, and lifted it up during the duration. Then on the gyroscope, it lifted us up on the z accent. So it's been pretty cool. I'm familiar with the C five because that's why I've talked a few people to do that, like the CEE five stuff where fly over with the UFOs or the lights in the sky. But I'm not You're the first one I've ever heard referred to six. I just made it up last summer. Okay, little pos encounters of a little more of a kind or something like that, and so, and it was discovered really a year ago last summer that I've did it for real and with a group of people, and I've done it now. In a group of two hundred people in Sedona sixty and Eureka Springs. We did a small went of Bradshaw Ranch. You ever hear a Bradshaw Ranch? Yeah, skid Marker ranch thing. I had an interview with someone last year about a Bradshaw Ranch. Yeah, it's a cool place. I like it a lot. I feel good there, but made a lot. We wrote a book on that, and I did a movie on it, you know, doing extremely well. You know, you can still make money. That was making a. Ton of money then every platform. So you just got to be lucky with these things. Yeah. So so right now I'm kind of just pursuing this paranormal aspect of stuff, following expanding the use of the protocol in different situations, seeing what it's going to result in. I know what the Bradshaw Ranch stuff they had from the guy that I talked to, it wasn't just like paranormal stuff, but they had bigfoot activity and he said he even found like large tracks that he also thought was like a soro pod. Yeah, we've seen that stuff too, like a big three tote thing. Ye, my son, he he actually saw the bigfoot. It's called big gall of all things. On the window of the Adobe house. I interacted with with an entity who was sitting on a chair. You could see it on an SLS. You know what those are these cameras, Yeah, cord like stick figures that when they find a human And this one was pretty good. It was sitting in the. Chair and I had a green light laser pointer and I pointed it at its feet. It took and looked down and kicked it with his foot and we have that red That's pretty cool. So when indicated had awareness and that was probably the coolest thing. And we also found a portal there that kind of worked unpleasantly with a lot of people's biology identified it by cold spot with a hot spot in between big electromag left a lot of magnetic fluctuations and it seemed to go in and out of existence while we were there filming. That sounds similar to what they have going on there like Skinwalker Ranch two with the magnetism and everything. So it is do you think these areas that are I don't want to come up all. I guess they would be a hot spot. But you think this is something that has some like with the all the activities because of something to do with all the magnetism itself. That's what causes these energies going on there. I would say, no, okay, you. Know right now we're working with the hypotheses which came from Jacques la kind of a famous Dudent war and everything pioneer and technology is one of the co founders of the first version of the Internet. And that's it's that there's a presence and Colonel John Alexander calls it the it because he said he can't think of a better word for because he was the first one to investigate Skinwalker Ranch and that that presence in masquerade pretty much any form of once from these tic tac type ufp UAPs or as a bigfoot, and they have a kind of physicality to them. But it's what actually it is. It's hard to say, and that's kind of what I'm trying to figure out because it shows up for us at these locations and strange ways in different ways every time. Yeah, do you so you've been writing this new book, and it's basically the high strangeness of Bigfoot. Correct. Do you believe that Bigfoot itself now that you've been investigating it, Do you think these bigfoot or just undiscovered species or you think there's a lot more to them than just an ape running around undiscovered? No mark I've been talking about. I think we can pretty much lay to rest the idea of Bigfoot being a separate species or a species of hominid that swings around through the trees in the woods or in the jungle, or lives in the outback of Australia known as the Yauzi or lives in the hamalias as the Yetti. For two reasons. The first, I think is the most important one is that there are no fossil There is no fossil record of such a being anywhere on the planet. Secondly, there with the ubiquitousness of cameras nowadays cell phone cameras, you would think that somebody would get a very clear picture of it that says, oh wow, this is a hairy beast that swings through the trees. Those are the two that's the first main reason. But the second reason goes back to what Ron was talking about in terms of the Jacques Vallet's control hypothesis control system hypothesis, and that is that this presence can manifest us whatever is needed in the moment to influence us in different ways. And in the book The High Strangents of Bigfoot, we look at this historically from around fifty thousand years ago, when it's considered that humans first began to learn speech or create speech, I should say, and to the present, and this presence manifests and thing in ways that are familiar to people at the time. So let's take Let's take Saint Martin of Tours who met a beggar on the road. He's a Roman legionnaire. He sees a beggar on the road, he slices his tunic in half, covers him, and then has a vision of what he should really be doing, which is protecting people instead of being a Roman legionnaire killing them. That's a very simplified version of his story. But this vision that he has is in keeping with his worldview at the time. If we go to Saint if we go to Joseph Smith, who founded the Mormon religion, an angel comes to him. This is the nineteenth century angels and demons are huge in the nineteenth century, so of course his his vision is going to be a manifestation of something that's familiar to him. Let's go to the twentieth century. We're going through world history very quickly. Here we go to the twenties. Can I just interrupt you. Nobody's ever captured an angel or a demon either that's true. That's true, which is very very salient. Go to the twentieth century. The worldview is changing. I'm not saying that God is dead or that religion is dead. I'm not saying that. But the worldview is changing. It's becoming decidedly more secular than it was in the nineteenth century. And that secularism is going to be seen by individuals who have these experiences. So you some individuals will see angels, some individuals will see demons. But other individuals who are are less religious are going to see things that are part of their worldview. Of U A. P s for example, a bigfoot of the dog man for as another example, cryptids as examples, because this is something that is familiar to them. And we all have uh familiars use the old Coven term familiars. We all have familiars that were that were that were very comfortable with, and those manifestations will come to us with I call it wisdom. They come to us with wisdom when we need it. And I think that is part of what Jacques Bela is saying with its control hypothesis system, This presence comes to humans with wisdom when we need it. I've mentioned before the I think a lot of these things that people's see might be the same thing, but they're only we interpret them as what we see them as or what they want us to see them as. But I think, like when people see a bigfoot, or like you said, even a dog man or an alien or anything like like something different, maybe it's because that's what it's being projected to us, and that's how we're supposed to be able to understand it, because we can't actually see what it really is, so it projects an image of what we can understand itself to be. So that's kind of that's where I think a lot of this stuff And if people have heard me before, like I say, a lot of this is connected. I think a lot of even with the paranormal aspect to it, I think a lot of it is somehow similar because someone says their house is haunted, you have all this activity going on there. And I interviewed someone before they said, think of Bigfoot as like a forest poltergeist, because if you have all the activity you have with Bigfoot in your house, you'd say your house is haunted. But this happens out in the woods, so they call it Bigfoot. Sounds like that makes sense to me. Well, the sailish in Indian words sasquatch, which is synonymous, of course with Bigfoot, doesn't doesn't refer necessarily to Harry Be swinging through the trees, but it does refer to a spirit that is in the forest and among many, many groups, whether you're talking about Native American groups or groups on oh in the deserts of South Africa or in along the Amazon, refer frequently to spirits that are around them and in the case say of of several Plains Indians, these spirits could be very important guiding spirits to you, whether they it's a part of a vision quest or maybe some other right that you're going through. Uh So, these these spirits, I think are extremely important to us, maybe less important to the scientific community, because it's the scientific community can't find what they call. And I'm gonna put quotation marks or air quotes around this, a rational explanation for a bigfoot or a haunted house. For example. That's no. I was just gonna say, that's that's kind of how I feel about it too. So yet all these things you can't exclude some sort of physical manifestation with them. The you know, the tic TACs SMaL you know, traveling at speeds that are impossible, you know, according to the normal consensus laws of physicalism or reductionist physics. We recorded for these in our thermal going just as fast, just as inexplicable. And you know there were there were there reel. As can be in some ways, but just impossible as well, because nothing we have could go that fast. They weren't like this cross for sixteen seconds. And in the protocol it happened instantaneously when I said to the group of two hundred people, look to the skies, and they showed up just to so as Alec coronel ogers, I say that these things are sentient. In other words, they they're aware of what's going on, and they seem to be pre cognitive to know to some extent what's happening. Before we do, Like when people see bigfoot running across the road, it's not an accident. This way of thinking and these things become life changing for people because this shift the world view people have if these things are possible, and they can't deny them, although you know they might try, they. Don't fit it. And so I think it's part of there's a shift going on right now, kind of like the death of physicalism. You know, the old scientific consensus that everything is material and energy and space and time. But that's just not good enough. That we humans have are are in many ways very unique, and we have consciousness and that needs to be explained among other things. I mean, it seems kind of ridiculous that there was in the beginning, there was a bunch of helium or hydrogen, and that led to Brandon. I was gonna agree. This makes me think of something that I heard recently when it comes like to the UAPs and like with a tip or altick whatever is pronounced as like some of the things that they've done to investigate. One of the guys that was in charge of it, I think his last name was Lakatski. He was telling people to stop thinking about it as like basically a nuts and bolts type of a craft if we see these things and without going because apparently he can't go breaking his o's or going off record or whatever it is. But the way I interpret of what he was explaining is think of these things more as a consciousness, spiritual type aspect to them rather than a space craft. And that kind of goes back into I just hear recently the Vice President claims these things are he said demons, which I thought was a random thing to say. That's his worldview. So yeah, So I want to come back to this a little bit because we're talking about science, and Ron was talking about science and how siloed it can be. That's not to say that modern science and technology isn't good. I mean, we wouldn't be talking the way we're talking right now without modern science and technology. It just wouldn't exist. But at some point modern science and technology has to break out of the very small box it's put itself in, that reductionist box that tries to explain everything down to the smallest little item as the as a way of saying, this is this is how everything's meaningful. And I believe, and I didn't always believe this because when Ron and I first met up for the first book we did on Aliens and big but he recruited me because of my skepticism. And one of the great things that Ron convinced me of as we've continued our working together in the last six to seven years, is that my stub my skepticism can make me so stubborn that I'm not able to see the force for the trees. So dialing back my skepticism, I'm able to say science isn't bad, but if it could break out of that narrow box it's put itself in, it might actually expand to even greater abilities than it has now. And then you know, science is just people doing stuff writing symbols, yeah. Language or mathematics. Yeah. The voice wasn't. Done by some human being wisconscious. And you could take all the written texts relating to you know, physics or biology and all the symbols, and if we had no culture to interpret them, they would be meaningless because they're just it's just the map that we currently think is, you know, the map of reality at best, it's not the story. But right now I think the shift is it's happening, is that we're beginning to to live with not knowing. I think all these things are asking us you can't figure them out. Those tic TACs, we can't figure them out. When those things showed up, similar types of things showed up at at Sedona. I don't know how to make sense that. Nobody knows how to make sense of it. We just got to kind of live in this state of we just don't know when. I think that's valuable, especially in relationship to the artificial and tells that are coming along because they can't they certainly can't function and not knowing. But mostly the great inventions come about when people are in a state of not knowing. They're just puzzling and thinking, and all of a sudden, boom, something something shows up that connected things that weren't connected before, like the classic example of things falling on Earth and planet's going around the sun. You know that these two things could be related. And most of the science occurs that way, when when things that weren't related become related, and that's the big step forward, and then you have some more of those, and then you have more problems and odd patterns, and eventually some person comes along and makes another set of connections and it just moves along like that. But I think right now it's good to be living and not knowing because that's where the creative aspect and juice of human beings that resides. That's just my opinion. It makes life a little more interesting, I think when there's stuff that we don't actually know, because it gives us something to research into look for more. I don't know if that's just a human trade or not, but we all have a feeling like there's something more than what we know. There's always someone else to it. Jack Malay talks about that with his control system hypothesis that the presence creates mysteries for humans. And I've said this before that humans are as curious as cats, and if the Earth really were flat, we'd like cats. We'd be chasing after everything and falling off the edge. I mean, we just would because we want to know about it. So that state of not knowing that Ron was talking about is the greatest source of our personal growth. And some people take it in different directions. Stephen Jobs, for example, took it in the direction of Apple and next thing you know, we have iPods, iPhones, imax. I mean, that's just an incredible display of technical of technologies from his not knowing. For some of us, though, the not knowing is long a spiritual path for some of us, So not knowing is long a physical path. You know. We don't know how fast we can run. We don't know how fast we can swim. Can you imagine Michael Phelps had gotten into the water and he went, oh, wow, this is wet. Well, I really don't care about it. No, he doesn't know anything about it. He goes, well, I want to find out a little bit more about this, And the next thing, you know, you know, thirty years later he's got twenty three gold medals and the greatest sports hero of our generation or of the millennial generation, not our generation. And it's not too like dig at anyone that's religious or whatever. But I've always thought it was interesting that a lot of people are willing to accept their religious beliefs without any sort of validation to it, like far as physical proof that they can prove a different like a higher power, like in like a god aspect to it. But the same people will not believe in UFOs or aliens or the idea of Bigfoot or these spirits or whatever. But you're putting all your faith into something of the same nature of a different type of a creator, a being, a different type of energy of power. But you won't believe in the aspects of some of these other things too. Human beings are strange, aren't they. Yeah, very much. Sometimes we find it easier to latch onto those things that feel familiar to us. So I'm just going to make a wild guess that all of us grew up in a household that had some connection to religion somewhere, whether our parents took us to church or our neighbors parents took their kids to church. So that's a familiarity to us. And whether we went to church or not, there's a huge familiarity just in the worldview around us. At all times. People are always talking about religion, and right now the president's in a war with the Pope of all things, I mean. So we're all conscious of different religious faiths, sort of driven into us through history and through our lives as we grow up. So say it makes sense that we gravitate towards those things that are familiar to us. But along your lines what you're talking about, Brandon, when we take the familiarity and use it as a skepticism to say nothing else can exist outside of it. Then we've really siloed ourselves into this small sort of worldview that doesn't allow us to grow. I don't think it allows us to grow spiritually personally, but it certainly doesn't allow us to grow in the sense of becoming more aware of who we are as human beings, who we what we can do as human beings. Our capabilities are we're not even really tapped into. I think a lot of the abilities that we can manifest. But I don't know if that's by design or just us not knowing right now, but I feel like there's things that humans are capable of that we don't even know how to scratch the surface of. M hm. So I think, you know, these people who are satisfied with Christianity, they're kind of source from the same thing. You know that there's there's a mystery to their to their life. They don't quite understand how it is that they are. There's an insecurity there. They know that they're vulnerable in their bodies, and so there's got the thought is there's got to be something bigger and better than just this, you know, being hungry running around and drinking and cooping and knocking each other around. There's got to be something else, and in many ways, these forms of Christianity is kind of an answer to It says there's a higher power, and that's somehow you're connected to that higher power. And I think that's okay. I think pretty much everything that, even my own, my own sense of of why I'm here, has never been totally satisfied. I still don't get how it is that I am, you know so, and I probably never will. But there's this, I think, ever since one's got language, they asked that question because they could. I don't think my dog worries about if he's going to go to heaven or no, or you know, how it is that he's existing and all that sort of stuff. It's us, human beings that want that asks those questions and feel the desire to we're connected to something bigger, and that's the mystery because we don't quite know what it is. And you know, it keeps me going, how about you, Brandon. I think it's interesting and this is just me thinking out loud, but it's always been interesting to me that we are basically the only species that I'm aware of. Obviously, there was offshoots, but we're the only ones that are we do what we do, like we're the most evolved in the sense that we live in houses, we drive vehicles, we have technologies, we do all those other things, and if you look at all the other species, there's nothing close to us. So it's like we are special in the sense that we are human, Like we have this ability, we have thoughts, we can think about things, we can actually think about, like religions, and we have these ideas, and apparently we make weapons and blow each other up too. But we're the only species that seems to do that. You don't see any other species like obviously primates now can they communicate amongst themselves or whatever. But it's not how we are talking, right, you know what I mean. They don't have the they don't have the humanization like we do. I think the redefining what it means to what a human is it is happening right now. Like you said, there's one aspect of it is the expansion of certain abilities that can emerge that are you know, quite surprise to say, precognition, even it's very short, for example, telecanesis. Did you ever bend a spoon or something like that by the wine. I've tried, I've never been able to do it. I did it really cool and it just was like buddy, but there was no heat to it, which would if you had heated it up, then it would have been pretty hot when it wasn't. So we did this interview with Colonel Alexander and he said that when they were looking for people to do telekinesis experiments like using their wine to kill things like goats, the first test was could they been in the spoon and if they could, could they accept that they could bend the spoon? And not everybody could. Surprisingly, it just didn't fit in with their world view, and so they were dismissed. And then the rest of it. I guess the ones that succeeded in both those tests, you know, move on and killed goats and who knows what else. So there are these capabilities, you know, and maybe it's all human in some sense. That's one of the new ideas emerging, is that there's little us and then there's big us, that this mystery is also us, that there's only the one and getting kind of wild here, Sorry about that. You're good. The the movie, I think was called the Men that ster at goats. Wasn't that about them trying to do that? That's right, Yeah, it was kind of you know version of it. I figured that the movie version wasn't one hundred percent accurate of what really went on because Hollywood likes to portray things a little differently than reality. So Pardinal Alexander said that they did succeed to be able to kill goats when they did the autopsy and the goat like it was a bullet moving to their heart, that there was no anti or exit. Mond, that's something would tell me. I know they used to try remote viewing. That's something that I think has been they've talked about, and that's where the people. Oh yeah, it makes me wonder if we're able to do that. And then you talk to people that say that they're able to leave their body, like travel the astral plane or whatever, like their consciousness leaves their body. We could like as being raised as a Christian, obviously we have a soul, is what I was raised is the soul basically our consciousness. It's our energy. And then people are able to leave their body and then travel around. And I've talked to people that supposedly are able to do this on command, Like they can go into a meditative state and they leave their body and they travel through these different things, They've interacted with, different beings from these different planes of existence. It gets to the point to where it's like, are they a different reality a different dimension? Like that's where my brain I started to get confused with it because it's like trying to process all this information and it's like, I don't understand how someone's able to do that, let alone like where they're actually going and what they're interacting. They're not alone in that, you know. That's that's pretty typical of the response we have near death experiences, right, same sort of kinds of telling of the inaffable what you can't really talk about these experiences, and so this idea that it's your conscious that leaves the body and still is aware, you know stuff, that's the twenty four of consciousness right now. That nobody nobody's really settled one, you know, any one. Of them particular. Yeah, they're all fascinating to think about though. So that I'd love hearing stuff about it. But at the same time, someone had asked me if i'd ever want to try it, and I was like, my luck would be I'd actually be the one that leaves my body but not be able to come back to my body. That'd be my consciousness or whatever it be, trapped wherever it is. Sounds like a Hollywood movie. You end up in somehow stuck in somebody else's body along with them. I better I better write it and get in touch with my Hollywood buddies and get a get a cut of that. So so I could. I can tell you one story like that. We have this thing. There's this prayer tree in a place in Colorado where people touch it and they have these weird experiences. It was something that the. Juden said done and this one girl, young teenage girl, did this and she described leaving her body and traveling. I said that was really cool, and she said, no, it wasn't. I'd never want to do that again. I've talked to someone before, and I've actually talked to several people. One version of the near death experience was they saw people from their path like it's almost the same, like they saw their loved ones that have passed away and they were around them. And then I've heard other people talk about when they passed they saw a light, but they were told not to go to the light, and if you go on the light, you're basically going back in a recycle event. So they didn't go to the light, and they started seeing these other things and that's how they started traveling around and seeing the other like these weird beings and other things. I was like, again, I don't know if this is true, because people can make things, you know what I mean, Like, you don't know what everyone's experience or maybe that's what they believed that was happening to them, but there's no real verification one way or another. It's just someone's account of what they experienced. Well, it's not unlike people who say they've been abducted by aliens, or that they've seen a UAP or they've seen Bigfoot. These I like to say about people who share their experiences. For example, one time Ron and I were discussing a book we were writing. It was called The book was called Simulation, and that the earth is the premise of the book is that the world that we now inhabit is actually not real. It's a giant ai simulation for the simplicities. And they were listening to us discuss this book that we're writing, and because we discussed the characters and everything, and the young woman they probably are about fifty years younger than Ron and me, and the young woman comes over and says, I don't know whether you guys would find this interesting, but we were abducted by aliens. And she and her partner, young man about the same age, sat down and talked with us for about ten minutes about their experience, and you could tell talking to them that they were not making it up. They were not like, oh, I'm we're going to titillate these guys and have fun with them. They were earnest, and in their earnestness, they revealed a lot about themselves personally, not I mean, I'm not talking about details or gory details or something, but about how they viewed life. And it was very important to them that they came out of this alien abduction situation feeling actually like they had had a beneficial experience. And then as soon as you know, they got done telling their tale, they thanked us and they walked away, and Ron and I went back to discussing the book simulation. But I came away from that and Ron has had similar experiences with people who come up to him talk about bigfoot sightings or UFOs, that these people aren't making it up. So when they're traveling on the astral plane or they're seeing bigfoot or something, this is very real to them. It is something that really has happened, and it's not a psychotic break. It's a real happening for them. I think when people come on my show, when I interview everyone, I'm not trying to prove or disprove anybody. I think everyone that comes on here believes what they're telling me. And I try and remain skeptic too, like you mentioned earlier, like your Skepta, I've had experiences and I try and write them all off. I try and explain them. That's the reason I made a documentary is because I want to know what happened to me, and I'm still looking for answers because for me, I'm kind of one of those people that was like I'm I didn't believe in a lot of this stuff. But the more I've experienced in life, I've now went from being skeptic too. I believe that there's something really going on and I can't explain it. But I think when people come on here. When they're explaining what happened to them, they one are telling the truth, like they did experience something. But I'm of the side of, well, maybe it's not exactly like they saw big Foot, but kind of like what we were talking about before. It's a bigfoot to them, But what if it's something else that they had seen In those four reasons, I feel like anyone that has these experiences, they're usually a reason why they have them. Yeah, So one of the ways to look at this is that people are taking seriously that there's quite a few of these different states of consciousness. People who are on Who's enogenics, you know, they have variety of different experiences that they talk about. We have dreams. There's a hypnogogic state in the states between between awake in a sleep where you're like in a theater of action and people show up there. You know. There are people that travel they ask to planes, what dear death experiences? They have different consciousness experiences. There's many of these types of things, not just one that seemed as human beings seem to be capable of experiencing one way or another. Mark and I do flow practices based on simple martial arts, and we get into a state where the doer is gone, there's no self anymore. Everything works out wonderful. In a number of cases. When I was in that state, my body returns to my twenty five version of my body and I move freely in a way that's just not possible normally. I mean recently, I was at a place where they where we were walking this place in Wisconsin where the Beasts of Very Road is, and I slipped into that state. And usually I'm the line, you know, because I'm old, and all of a sudden, I was totally free. I just charged a long way ahead of everybody else. And they said what was going on? I just said, well, I got into the state. So that's another state. And Mark, Mark's familiar with that state because we were basically there's a when I say we, there's a situational awareness and in a kind of power that's that can just not kill anybody instantaneously in that state because there's no self doing anything, yet things get done and it's weird as hell, right, Mark. Absolutely, we were training with a friend of ours, Dmitri, and I was attacking Dmitri, and he put himself in that state, and I would say that Dmitri touched me with all the power that you you stick your finger into cotton candy, I mean, and you know you would TI can stick your finger in without cotton candy, without very much power. And I remember that as I was falling backwards, I was thinking, oh, I can get my balance, and suddenly there was no earth beneath me. So whatever Dimitri was experiencing, suddenly I experience. And I'm like, I'm I don't know how I'm going to I don't know how I'm going to land because there's nothing beneath me. And then I hit the ground and it's like I come out of that state. Dmitri comes over and helps me up. But these flow states are not about being successful. They're about being in the moment, being in the now, and whatever happens is successful. That might be one way of saying it, but I don't like that term. Whatever happens happens, and there's no goodness to it, there's no evil to it. There's just simply what is happening. And there's no mark and there's no run. Yeah, I do. There's a variety of these things, and people are coming forward and beginning to see that there is a big variety of different consciousness states, and it certainly means that we as humans are much more unique than we ever thought we were. I do have a question, and the footprint on your wall besides you, has got me thinking about this. If these bigfoot creatures or whatever we're seeing are more of a spiritual type thing, how does stuff like that leave a footprint or some sort of physical evidence if they're not necessarily a physical being. So there's something really powerful behind that, right m Something really strange that we can't figure out, because you know, people have reported seeing a bigfoot and then it disappears and they go find the print I mean before their eyes. I mean I've talked to multiple people who have had that experience. So, you know, the tic TACs, they're they're they're impossible, going to the way we think, but yet they were there, so they they have a physical effect on they're creating a you know, a thermal image, you know, which is you got to be kind of physical to do that, like the ones we captured. Yet they're doing things that are would normally be impossible. So this, whatever they say, is allows for that to happen and you know, that's not normally that we can think about something. Right, If they're just spirits not to float around in our minds, they're not going to you know, people have you know, telekinesis in a way is kind of that, right? Do you have your mind and you kill a goat by thinking about it? Different? Is it? I mean, there's there's nothing there to look at. I don't think when when the telekinesis is taking place and then there's a result. Yet there's probably an experiences of the person who's doing that, has it has its own or her own experience of doing something right or something's happening that there's an awareness of it, not random. Somebody said, you know, kill the goat. My concern with that is if they're able to kill the goat, where's a stop at from there? Does that means someone could be out there just anywhere deciding they're going to kill any sort of person just from thinking about it. Well, it's only just possible, doesn't it. Yeah. The reality is, and people have said this before and asked me, is obviously when I did what I did for my film, I was out in the woods and doing all sorts of things, and they're like, are you afraid of what happens if you run into something? I was like, I'm more afraid of running into a person than i am a one of these things, because I was like, to my knowledge, the human is the more of the ones more likely to shoot me or kill me or something, rather than a hairy man out in the woods or a dog pan or something like that. I'm probably gonna have it more of a chance of getting shot by a property owner or something. O. Your parents were wise to let you know about that. Is it a good job? Well, when we talk about the footprints which you brought up in ron Sex, you can find the footprints. They go for a few feet and then they suddenly disappear. That actually also fits in with Jacques Malet's control system hypothesis that the mystery is there for a reason. If we actually caught the big foot, but we wouldn't have a mystery anymore. We go, aha, we have it, you know, And but the presence has that mystery for a purpose, and so the presence is able to manifest in the ways it needs to manifest, including footprints which go on for five or six steps or maybe a dozen steps and then disappear. The tic TACs that appear in the sky. They're zigzagging across the sky at impossible speeds and then they disappear. Do you I don't want to interrupt, but you mentioned tic TACs. You think it's odd that back in the forties they called them foo fighters, like the balls of light that they were seeing, and then everyone started to call them flying saucers, which was based off of Kenneth Arnold. I think what it was is an original depiction of wasn't really a salt. He said it was skipping like a saucer. So that's where the whole flying saucer thing came about. But what we know of these crafts like they've changed their appearance as we've changed our technology. So the more evolved we've gotten with our technologies, the description of these things have always been more advanced in the sense they're not the same descriptions. So they went from being the original depiction that he was like a crescent shape that had like these little almost looks like what we would call now the stealth bomber, but it was more rounded in the front rather than what we have, and then they turned into these crafts, these round the typical stereotype type of a UFO, like the round saucer crafts, and then they started to get triangular like Throughout the nineties and early two thousand they were all reporting these black triangles and everything. Now everyone's talking about tic TACs. It's almost like it. The more we get into it, the shape in the description of what these things are has also changed. Yeah, getting keeps the mystery alive, doesn't it. Yeah. The more you start to find things out, so you think, then it keeps on evolving too. The mystery just keeps being more of a mystery. So that's the heart disease. Part of part of it is is human ingenuity, and. It keeps us not knowing, keeps us not knowing. Yeah, so when you don't know something and you're guessing at it, your imagination can come up with fantastic things. When the when. The the Pilgrims came to the New World and they went out into the woods for the first time, they heard these enormous sounds. There's some in some of the diaries they talk about these enormous, incredible sounds, and they thought that there must be huge beasts out in these woods, like bears. It turned out that they were like raccoons because because you know, they had never seen a raccoon before, and and so that that no was that had to be huge. So humans imagination is great. We can go with HG. Well's War of the World's Jules Verne, Captain Nemo twenty thousand Leagues under the Sea. These great imaginations of science fiction that happened the day the first day the Earth stood still, I think it's nineteen fifty three. Has an actual saucer, which goes back to what you were talking about, Brandon, But by the time Star Trek comes around, it's still kind of saucer shape, but now it's got these kind of limbs on it. And then the the Romulans have war birds that are different looking and stuff. And by the time you get to Star Trek in the next generation, the imagination has is full blown. That ships can take any size shape. If your. A fan of SG one, some of them are pyramids, you know. So our imagination allows us to expand the definition of what we think is strange to from every kind of everyday household items like a saucer to a to a war bird. For a Romulan warbird, it Star Trek, the next generation. That doesn't mean that these that once we use our imagination to see something, doesn't mean that that mystery is solved. If anything, our imagination makes the mystery even bigger. And if we go back to Jacques Bela's control system hypothesis, that mystery is key to human evolution from the time we created language fifty thousand years ago. That's what most researchers believe is that humans didn't start creating language untill somewhere between one hundred and fifty thousand years ago. From that moment forward, we have evolved in many different ways, not only language, but technology and our religions of everything has evolved until we're at the twenty first century. I have a personal feeling that we've evolved for a reason. I haven't really pinpointed that reason yet round and I've discussed it many times, but my feeling is that the current AI technology, the LM technology, can mimic humans so well that what if the mystery the presence has been has been pushing this mystery on us to create a different species a a silicon species, for example, or something that mimics humans. I don't know. It's just for me since I'm a writer of science fiction and fantasy. I find that. A very interesting proposition. I saw a photo today and someone remade it with today's technology, and the original AI photo was generated in twenty twenty three, and you could tell it looked real in some aspects, but you could tell from three years ago that it was AI. The new photo of the same exact thing is very hard to tell that it's AI now, And to me, that's only been three years, and it's getting that hard to tell photos of being what was easily able to be detect that it wasn't real to things now that they're like, well is that AI? You have to question everything now because it's getting so realistic. And if it's that way within three years, what's it going to be like in another three years? So we're just three avatars talking to each other. Right, That's kind of That's kind of where I go with it, because the whole simulation theory is actually something that I kind of get into as even I can answer it in like religious aspect too. There is a creator. I was like, yeah, there is a creator, So what if the creator is whoever designed what we're in, like the world that we live in, our universe could have been part of their engineering. So everything that we're guessing and things that happen, and the strange things that are happening, and there's all part of some sort of a code that we're involved in this weird, strange simulation of a life. But I don't think it's like the matrix. I don't think we're just plugged into a machine. But the reality is if we're able to evolve and trans for our consciousness or whatever our energy and travel around and do all these other things, it's almost like you're upgrading. Like you said, when you go into these states when all of a sudden you have this energy where you're out leading ahead of people. Whenever you get this like state of that's not a normal thing. So how are we able to do that? Like for most people, they couldn't do some of the things that you guys have talked about being able to do. So it's like you've tapped into something. So it's the opinion I have here is that you get rid of the doer. The doer has to disappear when people have these mystical experiences, near death experiences, the doer the brand and the run and the mark is gone and then you can call that the ego. But the language part has gone too. That goes with it, because that's what the language createss, the ego of the self. And when they come back, they can't put it into words because there were no words or symbols in that sense, the normal sense. Because then and that's in the flow state too, that the doer goes away. And that seems to characterize almost all all these kinds of states that are you know, even even the lucinogenics, that the normal ego disappears and weird shit shows up. You know that. I don't know if if you ever had taken a trip, but you know what I'm talking about, the mystical experiences, religious ones, the self has gone and one is usually one no separation with God or the soul, something like that, and there's the language has gone again. So the language is what languages explains the world around us. If you think about a cat, the cat never tries to explain the world around it. Cat just sleep, gets up, eats, chases mice, goes back to sleep, you know whatever. It just does what it does. The cats three blocks, yeah, I mean, And if you've ever taken a dog out for a walk dog is all over the place because everything is absolutely in the moment for it. But humans are unique in that we have language, and we use language constantly to explain what's going around going on around us. So right now, each of our brains is looking at an image on the screen. I know this is only audio for the people listening, but each of us is looking at an image on the screen, and we're explaining what's happening through language. When Ron talks about the flow state, when you're in the flow state, there is He's right. The brain turns off the brain which is constantly explaining to us with words and symbols, which other species don't have, the only species on the planet that has words and symbols. Those words and symbols go away, and whatever happens happens. There's no goodness to it, no badness to it. It just happens. When Dmitri touched me and I fell down, I didn't feel as though Dmitri was doing something bad to me. All I thought was where am I going to land? The earth seemed to have disappeared, And I mean, I'm not even thinking that in the sense of how we're talking here, that actually happened after I hit the ground and they asked me what happened? I said, I tried to explain it to them, but as we have found out, going into the flow space, you can't explain it. The moment you explain it it it disappears you need it. You need itself to explain it. Yeah, yeah, just the way we talk. We had a We had a guy who wanted to experience what we were doing, and he brought a friend who was an actor. And I find that actors are fabulous at learning things. They seem to just get rid of their ego the moment they need to learn something, and they just learned it. Any rate, this guy had never worked with a weapon called a joe. It's a Japanese staff. It's about fifty inches tall and an inch in diameter, and we were doing a flow state exercise with that. He'd never done this before, but he went into that flow state and he was working with I think it was with Dimitri. At any rate, we watched him. He was perfectly in sync. Now, Dmitri is an expert with the joe, knows how to use it. This guy had no idea how to use the joint, never used one before. But suddenly he's in complete sink sink with Dmitri and they're moving effortlessly around each other. He puts the joe down. They stop. The guy puts the joe down. He looks at us and he starts crying because he'd never had that experience before and he couldn't explain it. So he wanted to have this experience for a long time as a meditator. His name is Lonnie Woodley. He's the father Hylane Woodley. You know, an a listening actress. You know who she is. She used to the Data or was married to Aaron Rodgers, wasn't she. Well, she hung out with Aaron Rodgers. I get to meet Rogers as the result of that that didn't work out. Uh so, yeah, this was you know, the dissolution of the self and the contact with the truth of whatever. The greater truth that showed up for him was something you know, seeking. But all he had to do is get rid of Lonnie. And it seems like there's about the movement practices that we do in are kind of like play martial arts make it occur quicker than you know, sitting on the couch. For sure, as you. Can sit on the couch like he had done, you know, for nearly twenty five thirty years, never had the experience that he was was told was available to the truth of who he is or whatever you you know, however you. Want to frame it. So one hundred thousand years ago, before we created language, were we were in that state most of the time, just in that state, in that flow state, most of the time at one as a hunter gatherer, whether we're in a clan situation or a small family group of some kind, you're in that situation all the time. All the technology that we've developed in fifty thousand years, it's very difficult to get into that into that state. You're driving in your car, you're going to the bank, you're this technology makes it very difficult to get into that flow state. So that's what makes it so unique to us. Now, it's not that unique to a person who like a hutter gatherer in the in the Uh, in the Amazon. They become one with that forest in that moment. There is no thinking of, oh, I'm going to have a huge meal when I catch this this deer. No, they're just simply in that moment. So there's there's a research now suggesting that Brandon and your Mark, we're in that state when you were children, before you knew language, m hm, that you're you're naturally in that state. And but it's also the state in which you just learn language. Nobody teaches it. You pick it up by hearing them, which goes to the another idea that the l ll M structure, that's the heart of the you know chat, JBT and Claude and all those that we have one operating too. That's how we're talking to each other. It's auto regressive in nature. So anyhow, perhaps you know we we somehow another we can connect with the time, the brief time when we were kids, when before we got language, when we were just in the everything was play, everything was just you know, you have any kids. I have four, so you know, you know there's that time when they're just three as can be right, Yeah, I've got I've got two teenagers and seven year old and as soon to be five year old. They're they're just transitioning out of you know, the Glorias state one's with the universe, and then of course they get to be teenagers, then they get to be social animals and watch out. Yeah, I've got a fifteen year old daughter and a thirteen year old son. Oh so you know that then too. Yeah, it's a it's a adjustment. We'll just say that before we've been going on for a little over an hour, before we wrap things up. Is there anything else you guys would like to discuss before we talk a little bit more about your latest book? Now, I think. That we pretty much we're starting to repeat ourselves a little bit in terms of the Jacques Belat idea of presence and mystery the flow state. So yeah, let's move on to the high Strangers of Bigfoot. Is this something that the book? Is it something that you guys have been talking about for a while. And started last summer when I did the first actual control what I call the C six Protocol, and all this weird stuff showed up that were recorded. And this was a place in the Rockies that had no paranormal It wasn't like a Bradhaw ranch or anything. It was just an area along a creek, you know, in the mountain. And then I took it to dont Shasta, which is just the opposite. It's probably one of the most noted spiritual places, and the presidence showed up in a different way, and so I did. I did a movie of this, because you know, that's what I do. I make movies. But I could not get into the historical aspect behind these phenomenas, such as the origin of music, which is auto regressive. Probably these humans that developed language were doing music first, which is auto progressive means the right note has to follow the next note. It keeps building that way because they could beat drums or you know, and that and trace these histories of the mystery how the paradigm shifts along for the next innovation and technology and a new paradigm shift and you get new instruments, and then it shifts again. And so the book really expands on that whole aspect, plus also telling the story of what happened at these two sites. That's kind of the essence. You can watch the movie on YouTube, you know, High Strange is a big foot and last I checked, there's over eighty thousand views on it, which is. Pretty good for a couple of weeks. And then the book has got the same title and you can find it on Amazon and Barnes and Noble, all those good places. Make sure to include links in the show notes for anyone listening. That would be really good. Yeah. So Ron has the actual experimental experience, and he came to me because I was trained as a historian at the University of Cincinnati. So then he asked me to investigate the historical aspects of the high strangeness of Bigfoot, where we get into the origin of language and how the presence manifests itself throughout history, from what I would say is to individuals for most of human history to the present day in the twenty first century, when thousands of individuals are coming forward with these kinds of experiences thanks to the Internet. So, for example, the Bigfoot is sort of an archetype in a way. It's the Harry wild man or how very wild woman who's free, you know, in the in nature, and there's a bit of us wanting to be that still, you know, And I think the Bigfoot that we see is kind of like that, that archetype, and that's in our mind, you know, the subconscious or the collective conscious of all people. You know, there there other types like the father or the mother that we all share. And one of the ways the presence to move things forward quickly is to shift that collective consciousness archetype in some way for everybody, because everybody seems to have access to it, at least in the way some people think about it currently. M there's a mental aspect, not just the physical. You know. The more I've gotten into a lot of this stuff, the more questions keep popping up. And that is one of the biggest frustrations I have, like doing my show, doing the things that I do, and I've realized that the answers that I'm looking for, I don't think I'm ever going to get. And that seems to be the thing with a lot of people that go down this path is we're always searching for answers, but we're never We're coming away with more questions. We're not getting that answer. And we've talked about this a little bit earlier. It's like we're we keep evolving the question like it just we're not. It keeps the human nature to keep wanting that mystery we have. We want to solve the mystery, we want the answers, but it just keeps changing to keep us going. That's the idea we're expounding in the book and the movie. M hmm. I think I said, I think it's definitely something that I'm going to end up checking out because it feels like it is right up my alley. A lot of the stuff that I'm the path that I'm going down myself, my own personal journey. I feel like this is something that I can relate with. Good. Well, we can probably wrap this up. But for anyone listening, where can they like? I do you want anyone to be able to reach out to you? Guys if you have anything coming up that you're going to be at or anything that you would like to let the audience know about. Uh, that next conference I'm going to be at is it in all the Illinois at the end of June. It's the Great American Ghost Conference. Okay, do you like ghosts? Yeah? I'm going to send you an email with a link to my documentary. It covers a lot of the stuff we've talked about it as paranormal. It's got UFOs and it's got cryptis all in there, all from the small area, so I think you might find it interesting. I'll tell you. I'll reply back with the link to Jensen Media for you. Okay, I appreciate that. So you should come to all not that far away from me. You could drive there. Do you happen to know what date it is? I'm booked on June twentieth. I'm doing an event in Indiana that I'm speaking out. So meanwhile, if people want to read the book, they can get it through Hangar Publishing or they can go to Amazon. It's at Amazon. And the movie Ron the movie is available on all the different platforms. You're Ron handles the movie. I'm just the author or co author. On the book. I'll send you the information on that conference. And Okay, you know where all Dent, Illinois is. It's kind of across from San Louis. Okay, yeah's probably about three hours away from I'm in north central Indiana. So is the documentary available only on YouTubers and on all the other streaming platforms as well. You okay, well, it's been a pleasure talking to you guys. Thank you very much for having us on. It's been great. Yeah, thank you guys very much. If you would like to be a guest on tenfoil Tels, remember to send an email to Tenfoil Tells Podcast to gmail dot com, or you can also go to tenfoiltales dot com and go to the contact section. Just make sure to reach out and get a hold of me and we will get something to schedule for a future episode. You can also find Tenfoil Tales on Facebook and Instagram. Just look for Tenfoil Tells podcast and reach out to me that way too. Remember to share the show around. Word of mouth is the best way to help the show grow, and just remember truth comes at cost. Are you willing to pay the price.